Hi! I'm not sure if it's appropriate to butt in on other peoples' comments, but it's specifically your comment that inspired me to express my thoughts, so... I wanted to let you know that your comment makes a LOT of sense to me.
(I had read this fic earlier, but couldn't think up a comment at the time. Still, this fic kind of... stayed with me. Was it because it was so disturbing? ;) Well, that too, but the events seemed plausible to me and this became one of my canons. (Yes, I can say that I have several alternative truths about the show - I don't think they cancel each other out.))
This part of your comment particularly hit a chord: "And certainly it's not the most romantic view to think of relationships as a check of balances and investments, but I think that Lisa feels she owes him. I don't think she resents that--"
In the context of your fic, this makes SO MUCH SENSE! And in the context of, you know, the world.
I'm not talking about sacrificing yourself for someone you love (that's what Ianto is doing, too) in general but about how women have been conditioned to this mindset that their body is something that can be traded. And Torchwood doesn't exist in a cultural vacuum. I certainly have followed the same logic from time to time. "He's such a nice boy and he actually listens to me. So maybe I'll let him have a cuddle even though it makes me feel uncomfortable." I think that could quite easily become "He's my boyfriend and has suffered so much just to make me stay alive, so I should let him have his reward."
Ok, now I'm just paraphrasing you. Anyway, thinking about Lisa's position in all of this added depth to the original piece of writing - even though the original piece was also brilliant in its sparsity. What you said about Ianto and Jack's relationship in your comment was really interesting, too! (even though I didn't understand 100 % of it) And your comment made me realize that my logic in rewarding boys for acting like decent human beings with physical intimacy is seriously fucked up. So you've also made a feminist effort. :) Thank you!
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*is enlightened*
Date: 2009-06-19 06:49 pm (UTC)(I had read this fic earlier, but couldn't think up a comment at the time. Still, this fic kind of... stayed with me. Was it because it was so disturbing? ;) Well, that too, but the events seemed plausible to me and this became one of my canons. (Yes, I can say that I have several alternative truths about the show - I don't think they cancel each other out.))
This part of your comment particularly hit a chord: "And certainly it's not the most romantic view to think of relationships as a check of balances and investments, but I think that Lisa feels she owes him. I don't think she resents that--"
In the context of your fic, this makes SO MUCH SENSE! And in the context of, you know, the world.
I'm not talking about sacrificing yourself for someone you love (that's what Ianto is doing, too) in general but about how women have been conditioned to this mindset that their body is something that can be traded. And Torchwood doesn't exist in a cultural vacuum. I certainly have followed the same logic from time to time. "He's such a nice boy and he actually listens to me. So maybe I'll let him have a cuddle even though it makes me feel uncomfortable." I think that could quite easily become "He's my boyfriend and has suffered so much just to make me stay alive, so I should let him have his reward."
Ok, now I'm just paraphrasing you. Anyway, thinking about Lisa's position in all of this added depth to the original piece of writing - even though the original piece was also brilliant in its sparsity. What you said about Ianto and Jack's relationship in your comment was really interesting, too! (even though I didn't understand 100 % of it) And your comment made me realize that my logic in rewarding boys for acting like decent human beings with physical intimacy is seriously fucked up. So you've also made a feminist effort. :) Thank you!